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Post by tabularasa on Mar 19, 2010 22:44:00 GMT -5
I thought I'd make a thread for my favorite character in DC, Tim Drake. I'd argue he's the best Robin so far and everyone should give his new series, Red Robin, a try. It's been solid for 10 issues now. I'm re-reading most of all his books starting with the 3 part identity crisis. I'll try to keep this thread updated with reviews of Red Robin and any old arcs if I can. This kind of specifically ties in with Batgirl since he has a long history with Stephanie and the two books have recently crossed over.
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wadewilson
Student
I love the smell of 372,844 pancakes in the morning. Smells like victory.
Posts: 11
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Post by wadewilson on Mar 20, 2010 1:16:15 GMT -5
Yeeeeeeee, I love tim (no homo). He's my favorite robin too. Also, I agree that Red Robin has been a solid book.
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Post by Stella on Mar 20, 2010 7:45:05 GMT -5
I very much agree that Tim Drake is the best Robin! I fell in love with him in Identity Crisis after such a tragic thing happened to him. In the little Teen Titans that I've read, I've really seen him as a strong leader. I was reading Red Robin, but then I dropped it and only picked up Batman. I will be getting Red Robin #10 in my MOC box, however, so I will be definitely reviewing that in ep. 6. I was going back and forth on whether to continue picking it up or not, since it seems like Steph is in #11 as well, and, depending on what happens, she may become a consistent presence. I guess I'll have to see if I need to rethink dropping the book or not...
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Post by tabularasa on Mar 20, 2010 8:06:14 GMT -5
I posted this over at crawlspace but it bears repeating here. This is a review of the 3 issue Identity Crisis that transformed Tim Drake into the new Robin:
Tab's Review of "Identity Crisis":
"Identity Crisis" is a 3 part story that will turn Tim Drake into the new and improved Robin. This arc is goes from Batman #455-457. All three issues were written by Alan Grant and penciled by Norm Breyfogle
In the first issue, "Identity Crisis" Batman captures a masked criminal whose gone on a bit of a shooting spree. When he takes off the mask, he's shocked to find it's an elderly woman. While he takes her into custody, Vicki Vale takes some pictures of homeless men in Gotham who are later murdered by the same masked criminal. Batman tries to question the elderly women, but she has no real answer for why she would kill two people. Bruce returns to the mansion where young Tim Drake awakens from a nightmare. At this point in the timeline, Tim has already figured out Bruce and Dick were Batman & Robin and sadly, Tim awakes from his nightmare to face another nightmare: His mother's funeral. In her studio, Vickie takes a closer look at her photos to see she's got a photo of the masked criminal who would later kill the homeless men. On the morning news, Bruce hears more about the masked criminals who he dons "Human skulls". Another one was found sooting customers in a connivance story before he was killed by police. The man had no motive for killing anyone. Bruce attends to Tim down in the cave where his anger is building and building over the death of his mother. Bruce tells Tim not to fight against his anger, but to live with it because someday it'll be his friend. Bruce, Alfred, and Dick go along with Tim to the funeral on a snowy day in Gotham. Afterwards, Dick tells Bruce that Tim is a pretty brave kid for his age. Bruce says Tim will want to put on the suit, but he won't allow him to. Vicki goes to the police station with a picture of the license plate to the car she believes was owned by the Human Skull who killed the homeless men, but reaches a dead end. She decides to pursuit more then the cops would. Bruce and Tim have an argument over Tim wanting to suit up as Robin. As Bruce suits up and goes out, he tells Tim that if he disobeys him, he'll never be Robin. Tim decides he'll have to find another way to prove he's ready to be Robin. Vicki tracks down the car in question, but is tracked down by one of the Human Skulls.
This first issue is probably my personal favorite of the three. The Human Skull story isn't that interesting as it stands right now but in the next two issues it'll get a lot more interesting. But as a Tim fan, this is a great issue that shows us where Tim is right now. He's agonized over the death of his mother, the last of his family, and today he has to say goodbye for good. He's very much in the same state Bruce & Dick were at this time in his life. Filled with sorrow and anger. A great scene in this issue is Tim's nightmare being in a cemetery where he sees the gravestones of Dick & Jason's family murdered. Right away he's being connected to the other 2 Robins. He yells at Batman and Nightwing in his his dream that death has to mean something. Tim is confused and searching for answers. Where does he go from here? The obvious answer for him (and even Dick and Bruce can see the obvious) is to be Batman's Robin. Bruce tries to tell Tim that no mask he puts on can hide from himself. And while it's not right out stated, maybe Bruce is talking about Jason. Jason was a troubled person even when he was Robin. And perhaps Bruce doesn't want the same outcome to happen to Tim.Vickie's involvement in this story is okay. It was a good way for the read to find out more information about where this trail is going to lead us when Bruce couldn't go into detective mode yet because his involvement with Tim. Overall I really enjoyed this issue for how much Grant dived into the psyche of Tim and the great scenes between Bruce & Tim. I give it an A.
The second part of Identity Crisis, "Without Fear of Consequence..." (Batman #456) begins with Batman stopping another Human Skull. He finds out from the lieutenant from the police station that Vickie Vale had come with what she thought was a big clue. Turns out the car was owned by Mr. Marcuse, a respectable man who runs a fur business. Batman quickly leaves to go after her. Marcuse has his men write addresses on three envelopes and goes to leave and catches one of his men, dressed as a Human Skull going after Vicki. Marcuse hints that he was the one dressed as a Human Skull and killed the homeless men. He gets in a car with his men and Vicki and tells her they're going to see a man. They take her to Gotham chemical building to see their boss. Vickie breaks from their grip and opens a door in the building and is shocked to see who is behind it. As Bruce is hot on Vicki's trail, Tim is at the bat cave trying to find out who is behind the Human Skull crimes. He has a dream of Dick and Jason, in the Robin costumes, telling Tim he can do this. Tim comes out of the dream and comes up with the conclusion who is behind the crimes. Tim calls Gordon and tells him to put up the bat signal because he knows who is behind this. He then goes against Bruce's wishes and heads off to Gotham Chemical to help him. But it's too late, Batman gets to Gotham central and finds out for himself who is behind the crimes: The Scarecrow.
I don't want to say this was a bad issue, it wasn't bad at all. But compared to the first part and what will be the third part, this was the weakest issue of the three. For one, when Marcuse takes Vicki to Gotham Chemicals building, it becomes pretty obvious Scarecrow is behind this. It's even more obvious when Tim uses the words "without fear of consequence" and yet we still have 5 or 6 more pages until it's revealed. While I felt the first issue did a good job of balancing out the Tim/Bruce/and Vickie scenes, this issue was a lot more heavy on Vickie and less about Tim and Bruce. I also have very mixed feelings about Tim figuring out the answer due to a dream of Dick and Jason giving him confidence. I get that it drove him to get the answer seeing the two former Robins, but I've never been a fan of someone solving the case from a dream (See: Twin Peaks) And really, this issue is just a set up for the third part of Identity Crisis. I'd give this issue a B-
The third and final part of Identity Crisis, "Master of Fear" (Batman #457) starts with Batman tied up in Gotham Chemicals with Scarecrow, Vickie, and Marcuse & his men. Scarecrow keeps Batman and Vickie captive, but tells Marcuse to go and gives them a bonus in an envelope. Scarecrow tells Batman he wanted Batman all along and the Human Skulls were just a trick to get Batman to him. He lets loose one of his chemicals on him that makes Batman think spiders are crawling all over him. In the car, Marcuse opens the envelope to reveal no money, but Scarecrow's chemicals which causes the car to crash into a toxic waste dump. Tim arrives at the building with a red ski mask and signature pole weapon. He makes quick work of Scarecrow's men but then is exposed to the chemicals. Tim is trying to fight it but he sees visions of him dying, his ultimate fear. But he gets help from Dick & Jason Robin in his vision that tell him he doesn't need a suit. He can fight the fear. It doesn't matter if he's afraid, the hero is inside of him. Tim fights through his fear and is able to take down Scarecrow by using Scarecrow's own chemicals against him. Tim frees Bruce and escapes just as the cops arrive. After helping Vicki, Bruce talks to Tim. Tim thinks Bruce is going to tell him that he can never be Robin, but Bruce says that a hero has to break the rules and go with his instincts and he knows that if Tim hadn't done that, he and Vicki would be dead. He finally, awards Tim by accepting him as Robin. At the bat cave, Tim admits he's worried about failing to keep up the symbol of the costume that was worn by Dick and Jason. Bruce says he doesn't want to have Tim bear that and gives him the new Robin suit. The issue ends with Tim in the new Robin suit telling Alfred and Bruce "Meet the new Robin!"
The final part of Identity Crisis is in no way shape or form a let down. What I love about this issue is that, just like the first part, it goes really deep into the psyche of Tim and what he's afraid of. He's afraid of failing. Not just failing himself, but failing Tim and Jason. He takes a huge chance going to save Bruce. Not only because it's dangerous, but also because by doing so he has gone against Bruce's orders and given up what he wanted and that's to be Robin. At this point, it's not about being a partner or a symbol. It's about doing what's right. And even Bruce can look past disobeyed orders because Tim has proven he's a real hero. This is vintage Tim Drake and shows us the kind of person he will be for the future and a Robin that we can all look up to. I give this issue an A. Overall, this is a great 3 story arc and a great start to Tim Drake's Robin. This is a must read for any fan of Tim or for anyone who wants to see what the big deal about Tim Drake is.
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Post by Noctis on Mar 22, 2010 9:53:24 GMT -5
Just so that there's a little more Batgirl on the dinner plate; I'm not sure if you know or not but Tim and Cassandra Cain did share several..."moments" together. For instance: [/img] [/spoiler]
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Post by Stella on Mar 22, 2010 16:37:49 GMT -5
Wow...that picture that you sent me of Cass and Tim in the air makes more sense now...
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Post by Noctis on Mar 22, 2010 17:08:11 GMT -5
Wow...that picture that you sent me of Cass and Tim in the air makes more sense now... Had to think back and remember, then it suddenly came to me. Yeah, my V-Day tribute: One of several Cass & Tim "moments". And remember to ask yourself, all you Tim x Steph fans out there, who lived together at Bludhaven after the Gotham City Gang Wars? ;D Uhuh ;D
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Post by Stella on Mar 22, 2010 20:09:10 GMT -5
Wow! Haha, well, I haven't seen Tim and Steph in action yet, so I cannot give my allegiance to either 'ship.'
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Post by tabularasa on Mar 22, 2010 20:43:38 GMT -5
Tim and Steph were "ok" nothing too special and as it went on it just seemed like a doomed relationship. Without trying to spoil it for anyone who hasn't read Batgirl #8 yet, I just don't see this ship setting sail again. The characters are in 2 different places then they were before. Besides, anyone who has read Red Robin knows Tim already has a new love interest.
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Post by Stella on Mar 23, 2010 9:14:04 GMT -5
Please don't tell me it's one of those cretins who were stalking him in the first three issues (that's all I read).
Also, tabularasa, when does Tim reveal (or when does he just find out) to his father that he's Robin?
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Post by tabularasa on Mar 23, 2010 9:31:34 GMT -5
No, it's not them. I think it becomes pretty clear who his new love interest for that book is in issue #7. You'll probably be able to tell a little earlier then that, but without a doubt you'll know exactly who it is after reading #7. As for when his father knew, I'm not sure what issue, but it was after he learned to walk and married his trainer Dana Winters. His business goes bankrupt and he loses his house. He finds out that Tim lied to him about trying out for the football team (which was one of Tim's excuses as to why he was out) and searches his room where he finds the Robin stuff. He confronts Batman, even though Bruce doesn't say anything, Jack figures it out. Tim decides to keep Jack quiet about the identities, he gives up being Robin, even though that didn't really last.
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Post by walkka on Mar 29, 2010 14:34:54 GMT -5
Tim is fun, but my 2 cents is that . . . Dick is better. I like Tim don't get be wrong but when I think Robin I think 60's show, I think the first 3 volumes of Batman the animated series and I think more or less the golden age of Batman and Robin. The Dynamic Duo. The Boy Wonder. To me Dick esstablished the character for me. He is the dude that showed me what Robin is to Batman and I think that is irreplaceable to the character of Robin. That all said. Tim brings his own personality to the role, unlike Jason. He challenges Batman unlike Dick and is a great character in the end. He is a great Robin with lots good stories.
The way I see Dick is he made the character and Tim is improving it. I think my only issue with Tim is that he and Bruce are to similar. I like how Dick is different. Has a brighter look on things in contrast to Batman and Tim being dark and brooding. (I would like to touch base on the fact that Tim isn't as extreme as Batman and does have some more positive view like Dick but for the most part Tim is written as mini Bruce and I don't like when that happens.)
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Post by tabularasa on Mar 30, 2010 9:34:10 GMT -5
What I'd like for Tim is after the return of Bruce Wayne is all said and done (meaning Bruce returns as Batman, Dick returns as Nightwing, and the fate of Damian as Robin is revealed) I'd like Tim to get his own persona besides Robin or Red Robin.
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Post by Stella on Mar 30, 2010 19:34:39 GMT -5
Hmmm, interesting! In a way, Red Robin was a pretty original persona, only held by Jason Todd. And, if Kingdom Come is any indication (I hope not) then Dick will be Red Robin. Would you accept Tim as Nightwing, hypothetically speaking?
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Post by tabularasa on Mar 30, 2010 23:17:35 GMT -5
Personally, I'm not a fan of characters switching personas. I'd like Dick to remain Nightwing and Bruce to remain Batman. I guess what I'd really like is Tim to have a persona that's not a bat or a robin. Nightwing was Dick's own thing and was very smart for the writers to try and seperate him from the Robin persona as much as possible. That is what I'd like for Tim. However, now that I think about it, maybe that should wait a bit. I think Tim is too involved with Bruce right now to make a clean break.
But if Tim were to be Nightwing, I would have no really big problem with it. At the end of the day, it's the guy behind the mask. I'm not a Dick Grayson fan. There's several things that irk me about his character. And while I love Batman, I'm not really interested in Batman now because it's Dick wearing the cowl. I think the same could be said for Babs. If she were given the ability to walk again but given a different persona from Batgirl or Batwoman, wouldn't you read? As long as it's Tim and Tim the way I know him and the way he's been written (for the most part Tim is one of those characters who hasn't been messed with too much, thank god) you can count I'll be reading that book.
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